Possibly moving to all-male African setup

[chris_todd]

So we have two tanks with mixes of Africans, a 65g and a 110g. In each tank, we have a mix of males and females, but because they are community tanks, we've never really had any successful breeding. Sure, we get holding females, but never any fry. For various reasons, I don't have the space/ability/inclination to setup tanks we could move the holding females to.

So we're considering consolidating to an all-male tank using the 110g, which we would move up from the basement and replace the 65g upstairs.

My question is whether the males will continue to be as nicely colored up as they are once we remove the females? We have several species of Peacocks, Protomelas 'Steveni Taiwan', Protomelas taeniolatus, O. lithobates, Hap. sp. 44, Hap. sp. 35 'Tomato', Pundamilia nyerei.

We're also wondering what kind of aggression we'll likely have to deal with between males of similar species. For example:
Protomelas 'Steveni Taiwan' vs. Protomelas Taeniolatus
Hap. sp. '44' vs. Hap. sp. 35 'Tomato' vs. P. nyerei

Finally, should I keep just the alpha male from each group, or should I keep a couple of the sub-dominant males as well?

 

[hollyfish2000]

1. Yes, the males will stay colored up.
2. The "rule" is one of each species and none that look similar. Whether or not something is "similar" enough to spur aggression is somewhat individual to the fish involved, so you can always try. But with an all male tank, you always need a small separate tank to remove either the bully (there will be one and probably more than one over time) or to remove the injured fish/fishes getting the beat down. It takes a while for an all male tank to shake itself into equilibrium IME.

Tony and others will weigh in with more experience than I . . .

 

[DiscusnAfricans]

So we have two tanks with mixes of Africans, a 65g and a 110g. In each tank, we have a mix of males and females, but because they are community tanks, we've never really had any successful breeding. Sure, we get holding females, but never any fry. For various reasons, I don't have the space/ability/inclination to setup tanks we could move the holding females to.

So we're considering consolidating to an all-male tank using the 110g, which we would move up from the basement and replace the 65g upstairs.

My question is whether the males will continue to be as nicely colored up as they are once we remove the females? We have several species of Peacocks, Protomelas 'Steveni Taiwan', Protomelas taeniolatus, O. lithobates, Hap. sp. 44, Hap. sp. 35 'Tomato', Pundamilia nyerei.

We're also wondering what kind of aggression we'll likely have to deal with between males of similar species. For example:
Protomelas 'Steveni Taiwan' vs. Protomelas Taeniolatus
Hap. sp. '44' vs. Hap. sp. 35 'Tomato' vs. P. nyerei

Finally, should I keep just the alpha male from each group, or should I keep a couple of the sub-dominant males as well?

The males may keep their color, but without females to show off for, and in the presence of other more dominant males, they may lose some of their color. The dominant fish will likely remain unchanged, but there will likely be a new power struggle once they are all reintroduced.

I have found the peacocks are more likely to lose some color compared to the haps. I have an all male 180 with peacocks, haps, and a little of everything else, where most of the fish show full color. A few of the smaller peacocks are a little muted, but most display well.

The aggression between similar haps hasn't been too bad. The Rhoadesii dominates the Red Empress and Taiwan Reef, but both show decent color. I've never had 2 different vic males in the same tank, but I imagine the agression could get bad if not properly scaped. My pundamilia species tank has some very rough sub males kept in check. With the proper hiding places provided, the shyer fish will have a place to retreat when needed.

How about making the 110 the male show tank, and keeping the 65 for sub males and females? I would keep at least one sub male from each group if possible, in case you do have hyper aggression in the beginning, but with the right stocking density you may not have anything too vicious.

 

[Tony]

Holly and Michael pretty much nailed it.

Not sure if I have that much to add beyond that other than the fact that the 110 that you have used to be my all male Malawi tank before I got the 180.

With that footprint, I'd stick to fish that max out at around 8" or so. Avoid the largest Protomelas and any of the predators - Nimbos, Aristo, Champso, etc. They need a 6' tank and are good at oppressing their tankmates.

I've actually seen less aggression in all-male setups than a lot of the species/ multiple breeding group setups I've been messing with lately. Without the woman folk there, there's not so much to fight over.

 

[chris_todd]

Cool, thanks for the advice everyone! I'm going to try to move things around before the November meeting, so maybe I'll have a few bags of stuff for the auction.

 

[marge618]

So we have two tanks with mixes of Africans, a 65g and a 110g. In each tank, we have a mix of males and females, but because they are community tanks, we've never really had any successful breeding. Sure, we get holding females, but never any fry. For various reasons, I don't have the space/ability/inclination to setup tanks we could move the holding females to.

So we're considering consolidating to an all-male tank using the 110g, which we would move up from the basement and replace the 65g upstairs.

My question is whether the males will continue to be as nicely colored up as they are once we remove the females? We have several species of Peacocks, Protomelas 'Steveni Taiwan', Protomelas taeniolatus, O. lithobates, Hap. sp. 44, Hap. sp. 35 'Tomato', Pundamilia nyerei.

We're also wondering what kind of aggression we'll likely have to deal with between males of similar species. For example:
Protomelas 'Steveni Taiwan' vs. Protomelas Taeniolatus
Hap. sp. '44' vs. Hap. sp. 35 'Tomato' vs. P. nyerei

Finally, should I keep just the alpha male from each group, or should I keep a couple of the sub-dominant males as well?

PM sent