At the risk of showcasing my ignorance...

Andrewtfw

Global Moderators
Can you have a EA predator tank or is the aggression too much? How does it compare to larger CA/A cichlids? Do any of you keep a predator only EA tank? Are names including Tyranochromis just names or do they truly speak to the aggressive nature of the fish? Gracias para mi educacion!
 

dogofwar

CCA Members
What's EA Predator? Extremely aggressive?

Never kept Tyranochromis but I'd bet that they're like other big, angry Haps like venustus, fuscos and the like. Big tanks..

Matt
 

DiscusnAfricans

Past President
Is East African the same as the Rift Lakes? I have some predators in a male show tank, but its not exclusively predators. They're not really overtly aggressive, unless you are small enough to fit in their mouth.

I'm sure things would change in a breeding setup. I know Tony had a nasty Venustus breeder that would keep all other fish on 1/3 of a 180 while he tried to spawn. Not sure if Venustus are pure predators, but they are piscivors by nature. I think the problem is most predators get fairly big (8"+) and when big fish decide to be angry, it can lead to trouble.

What kind of setup and what size tank are you considering?
 

Andrewtfw

Global Moderators
I am not considering changing over one of my tanks at this time. I was thinking about the aggression associated with CA/SA including red devils, festae, managuense, etc. and wondering how that aggression compares to the aggression of larger, predatory cichlids found in the rift lakes. I have not seen a tank where anyone exclusively has these predators which has me thinking that perhaps they are not as aggressive when as some of the CA/SA are. I am not considering Microlepis in my thoughts due to size and known conspecific aggression.
 

dogofwar

CCA Members
Different aggression from Malawi haps than from big bruiser CAs...

Packing them in (intentionally overcrowding haps) works well to diffuse aggression while it won't work (for long) with CAs.

Matt
 

DiscusnAfricans

Past President
I think big CA fish are much more territorial than EA fish due to their spawning strategies. CA fish actually have to defend a nest site, protecting young through development and free-swimming stages. They benefit from long-term protection of a suitable site. Mouthbrooding fish only need to defend a site long enough for spawning to occur. Once spawning is complete, site defense is optional until the next courting female comes along.

I've seen EA tanks with 15-20 large fish in them without terrible aggression issues, but it seems like most CA tanks can't handle more than 6-8 large fish depending on the type of fish being stocked.
 

Avatar

Plenipotentiary-at-large
Never kiss and tell

I know Tony had a nasty Venustus breeder that would keep all other fish on 1/3 of a 180 while he tried to spawn.

Really now, please remember that there are children who frequent the forum.

I suppose this is a common problem with keeping tanks in certain rooms of the house.
 

Tony

Alligator Snapping Turtle/Past Pres
I think big CA fish are much more territorial than EA fish due to their spawning strategies. CA fish actually have to defend a nest site, protecting young through development and free-swimming stages. They benefit from long-term protection of a suitable site. Mouthbrooding fish only need to defend a site long enough for spawning to occur. Once spawning is complete, site defense is optional until the next courting female comes along.

I've seen EA tanks with 15-20 large fish in them without terrible aggression issues, but it seems like most CA tanks can't handle more than 6-8 large fish depending on the type of fish being stocked.

Mike's got it pretty well nailed down.

It's night and day between a breeder setup and all males. You can keep many of the most aggressive males (Tyranochromis, Aristochromis, Buccochromis, Nimbochromis) together in an all-male tank with minimal concern over aggression, so long as you pick species that aren't too similar looking. Combine them with some less-aggressive predatory and non-predatory haps (big Protomelas, Champsochromis, Dimidiochromis, Fossochromis) and you'll still have a relatively peaceful tank. There will be nipped/rounded fins, but only slight pwn'age.

Throw in some females and things get real nasty though. If you were to try breeding groups of big boys in a 180, you'd probably be cool with 2-3 adult groups of the more aggressive/larger types and maybe 3-4 of the less aggressive/smaller ones. In the more aggressive setup, extra males would not likely last for the long haul. (It's gonna be interesting to see what happens here in the next year with my setup.)

Like you said, Andrew, Boulengerchromis would likely need something like an 8'x4' tank. Big Tangs are a whole different story from Malawi haps aggression-wise. Even more reasonably sized than the emperor cichlid, I'm told that something like Lepediolamprologus will not play nice with anything if paired off - even in a 6' tank.
 

neut

Members
Some good points already. Totally different thing between some of the large, meaner CA fish, some of which can only be kept by themselves in a tank or as a pair in a divided tank (unless you have a very large tank) and typical Malawi predators. Lot of the larger Malawi predators are actually (relatively) peaceful (aside from eating smaller fish) and not much problem to keep in a male display tank. Typical Malawi rules apply-- best to keep them in a group setting to minimize aggression-- but you don't have to crowd them like you do mbuna, and really shouldn't crowd them to the same extent, meaning tank size is a factor to keep these typically larger cichlids.

Naturally, like most Malawis cichlids, you can always get an individual stinker and territorial behavior or aggression increases when spawning or courting females. I've seen many nice Malawi predator tanks, they make an impressive display in a large enough tank.

As far as Lake Tang, the primary piscivore (fish predator) in the hobby would be cyphotilapia, which may or not be predatory in a tank (very often not, but you never know) and while they have their own quirks and requirements, they are, again, nothing like big CA nasties.
 

longstocking

Members
The closest thing you are going to get to the big nasties from ca/sa are Petrochromis. They can and will kill if they want to in hours... just like our new world friends. BUT, they are not predators... they are herbivores... with enormous attitudes and aggression. Imagine a Tropheus aggression... then multiply it by 10.
 
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